Sceners Threaten to Destroy BitTorrent, “One Step at a Time”
SuperTorrents recently fell victim to an attack by alleged ‘Scene’ members who revealed the site owner’s identity. Further action was promised against torrent sites and today another tracker admin’s life has been turned upside down. The attacker’s message: “Destroying The P2P’s, One Step at a Time”
At the end of last year Torrentfreak reported on the unfortunate fate of Ersan, the administrator of SuperTorrents. He suffered multiple security breaches which revealed his identity along with the loss of $2000 in donations. Scene notices (text files carrying news/other info) carried lots of the gory details, with one ending in a threat: “cellkill is next”.
It seems that “cellkill” – the administrator of Feedthe.net (also known as FTN) has become the group’s latest BitTorrent victim, exactly as promised. In yet another notice with the header “Destroying The P2Ps, One Step at a Time”, part of the justification for the attack reads:
Many have heard of him, but have never spoke to him, for a p2per word of him has come far as the scene. [real name removed], the owner of another torrent site called FeedThe.Net (FTN). His Torrent site steals thousands after thousands of releases from the scene, and then he has the nerve to go and say to other P2P’s STOP STEALING RELEASES FROM US?!??!? ILL BAN YO ASS! But wait, how is this even possible??
[real name removed] isn’t on the “Staff” page yet he’s still banning people, posting news and running the entire site. Mr. [removed], did you really think you were gonna leave without us giving you a goodbye present? Guess again”
The grim reality becomes clear as detail after detail of this admin’s personal life is revealed. His real name, date of birth, place of residence, personal email addresses, home ISP and IP address, places of education, friends, family – it’s quite a grim read. The claim that CELLKiLL is currently studying ‘Computer Security’ must pile on the embarrassment in spades. Family and friends who have also had their identities revealed can’t be too pleased that their FaceBook profiles are now public information.
Does this action against FTN signal the end of this ‘war’ on BitTorrent or will the MPAA and RIAA be rubbing their hands with delight on a regular basis? At least one other admin has been threatened for helping the admin of SuperTorrents after the original attack but there aren’t any more specifics at the moment.
The attackers left with this message: “We have yet again erased another torrent admin from existence. Other Groups, do your part to make the scene what it was in the beginning. Secure.”
My comment on the issue is that these persons who are participating in these acts of degradation represent only a small, arrogant minority of the scene. Within the scene comes some of the most talented hacking/cracking skills available, and these powers can either be used responsibly, or irresponsibly. I’m not to sure if the ’sceners’ here will actually accomplish their goal of making the scene more secure. The biggest threat to the scene is laws and legislation, police task forces and anti-piracy organizations who attempt to infiltrate and bust them. Second from this would be people who give out IPs and locations to the warez FTPs and sites that the scene groups upload to. Therefore, it does not make sense to find private torrent site admins and then give out their personal information. The P2P portion of the internet is more valuable to the scene then they think it to be, by providing a larger source for pre-airs, screeners, and other goodies. Until the anti-p2p pro ignorance attitude stops coming from some scene members, this ugly and unnecessary war shall be waged for long to come.
source: enigmax, torrentfreak | ftnobar-cellkill.1.rar
Comments(276)
I loled.
WoW.
How can total strangers be so vindictive toward someone who was providing a free service???
The world we live in………sad.
im going back to using smoke signals
n carrier pigeon
Death to P2P, long live the original, IRC (untraceable)
im confused….so the people who steal and hack the releases in the first place are upset that others are spreading their stolen work..i tohugh the idea was to spread the releases not punish them…who is fighting who here!!!
that makes me a sad panda
Forget IRC, lets go back to BBS’s.
“His Torrent site steals thousands after thousands of releases from the scene, and then he has the nerve to go and say to other P2P’s STOP STEALING RELEASES FROM US?!??!?”
These ’sceners’ are not too bright. How hypocritical can they get. They steal copyrighted material, make it available to be shared, then moan about people stealing. Hmmm
This just shows how the scene is or has been… You get one person who gets greedy and then the entire system fails. My personal feelings on this is that someone in the scene is simply seeing this as a chance to take props that they didn’t do or this is a scene vs scene via a non scene attacker. Either way someone is on the inside and is making life miserable so our mission is to find this person and terminate ASAP. Let this be a warning to all that you are not safe with all scene groups as I am sure this is the start of much bigger event. I look towards heavy virus useage in releases and trust to be exploited with false release names.
at last they are doing something. GO SCENE’s!!! im with you
not using any p2p progs…
wtf is the scene doing? isn’t this all about freaking sharing?
I thought it was l33t, to be able to look down on this and smile instead of starting a war. p2p never threatened the scene, sometimes having even better releases than the scene.
Scene groups using p2p sources.
People who steal b1tchin about people who steal.
People doing bad things to people because they do bad things.
People in little closed clubs who then have a go at others because they aren’t in those clubs.
The irony of it all.
See, this is the reason these “scene” people with mad skills aren’t earning BIG money in a big company, no social skills, no people talents at all.
sorry. but what is p2p
P2P is GREAT! And some people don’t realize all the positive things P2P offers. I also agree with comments above. If you don’t want your “stolen” “Hacked” material shared, then keep it to yourself in the first place!
I agree with @2… Wow… dangerous behavior from the “scene extremists” (for want of a better term). Outing P2P admins is risky, as they could encounter a backlash of resistance/attacks – not least of all from real/pure Scene members. The Scene isn’t the only group of hack/crack-savy people. They’re either very brave and very secure… or very deluded. It could be their details, and those of their family, posted next.
Hopefully more informed readers can tell us whether the individuals outed were ‘deserving’. Regardless, family and friends’ details should be off-limits to any ethical person. Not impressed.
Damn I really hate them sceners,,, but the p2p will never be stopped imo… there will always be people who will “give their last breath to defend it” (quote from: 300)
You are always gonna get that ‘one bad apple’ syndrome. Someone or some group who think they are better and that their way is the only way. I say we send every hacker after the ‘exposers’, give em a taste of their own medicine…
well, i love this warez scene war, its pretty fun.
like the little fight we had,HATRED vs Razor vs reload vs dont care, its funny sh1t.
anyway, hf sceners.
They aren’t proper sceners who are doing this, i know for a FACT it’s only dumb kids. They have only been in the scene for a few years and never even knew what the scene was like LOL.
Kids go home.
P2P = Peer-to-Peer Networks
Ah, it’s probably one or two dumb whackjobs who still live in their mother’s basement and whine about the ‘old days’ before the world wide web when they could easily find child pornography online.
@2 they dont offer a free service you have to donate for private trackers but these owners of the trackers are making a fortune. sad fact is they steal the scene releses then charge dumm asses for it that use private trackers nuff said
even the title is funny. destroy bittorrent. ifpi, riaa and mpaa tries that for years and they have much better weapons in their hands. closing a private tracker with few thousand members is nothing. with their thinking, these scene people should focus on public trackers like TPB with millions of peers. but i highly doubt they will succeed in something what way more powerful organizations unsuccessfully tried for such a long time.
this topic could easily lead to a very long discussion but i will just add one more opinion: isn’t it better to clean your own rows first? people uploading at private trackers must have some connection with the scene and if you shut it down, there’s no possible way to leak all the releases. but that is obviously much more complicated task than looking up few details about a stupid kid who spreads all his personal info on the internet…
anyway, “real” scene roxx
scene SUX
one down, millions will be up tomorow
and articles like these give them ‘credit’, simply ignore the idiots…
oh a new movie…
Seems good to me, a lot of heat is taken off the scene and the begging torrent sites get KO’d. Used to be most people downloading stuff were also big buyers of films and software and music. Cracking some dongle protection would take months and the people who got it would use it for personal use or creatively.
Now these torrent sites are acting like middlemen, spreading the data to so many people some of them are just out to grab and run. Begging for donations and charging VIP memberships, wielding power like they own the goods.
The scene is the only place where security through obfuscation works ok. Make people work a bit to get something unique instead of praising some 15yr old admin on a 2 bit torrent site for pressing “create torrent”.
Who is the target of the sceners releases then, if not the ppl outside the world? They do it their friends? Then they soo called friends steals from them in the first place. Or to sell their rls in some pay/download ftp, usenet, etc sites? Then they are just fu*king criminals, whos sell their stolen stuffs in the street.
Ok, his info became public, but how did they get that info? Doing a “whois” on a domain usually returns all owner info, (address as well, although it might not be legit), so that’s not much of a problem for the domain’s owner i guess, ’cause his info was already there for everyone to see…
So all comes down to sql injection or other bad sh*t you can and will do to anyone in case you feel that someone did you any harm… can’t we all just get along?
@ Martin (staff):
No offence, but if a bunch of skilled sceners would really try… then no site would survive. High ranked/skilled sceners aren’t your average scriptkiddy, but skilled hackers/crackers with botnets/resources we can’t imagine.
@ people who hate these people or don’t understand them, it’s simple. The scene is supposed to be secure, releases should stay within the scene and nothing is supposed to be made publict. So it’s logical sceners hate (see alote of nfo’s out there) p2p (kazaa/bittorrent/etc.). Their respected releases get spread out to total n00bs and insecure people. However alot of sceners this days are not sercure anymore.
iditax: sure, they have resources to do this. but those usually aren’t real sceners but hackers who usually do similar things for profit (the connection between those two groups is for another discussion). and even if they shut down one site (which is usually just a temporary thing), there will be 10 others growing up in few days. i think that bittorrent in current form is undestroyable, no matter if you like it or not…
It all sound very cliquish. The more people that share on these networks means that more people upload. It also draws more people into sourcing films, music, games etc leading to faster releases and better quality.
Scaling down file sharing online is good for nobody but these arrogant, elitist arseholes.
Long Live BitTorrent!!!
I’m sorry, but aren’t we all thieves in the first place? Why all this hate?
guys you don’t get it, do you? The real reason why sceners are against the p2p is that, because as their release is leaked millions of ppl start downloading it. Well imho till this point they call p2p guys lames, trash etc… BUT! Organizations like RIAA MPAA etc. are hunting them because THEY were the source of the release and in the end they’re “responsible” for damages which piracy cause well yes in fact from scene to uploader in every torrent site every1 had is “guilty” part but sceneres were the 1st. Well without scene there won’t be much to upload. Do you remember the situation about Bioshock? It hadn’t been cracked by any scene group and the result? Yes, someone with decent skills “from p2p guys” finally cracked it but in numbers this delay of 2 weeks made the Bioshock the difference between commercially successful and not successful. If the Bioshock would be cracked let’s say one or two days before official release, it woud mean that even the biggest p2p lame operating at piratebay or whatever could download it till let’s say till release date and then the profit is over.
Conclusion: If sceners won’t be blamed for piracy in the first place AND if some p2p admins won’t accept “bribes” by accepting VIP status by simple donations this would never happen. Who disagrees?
These “sceners” are so immature.
Pissing in a sea of piss.
@marting
true it’s indestroyable, but messages like this sure scare admins, and maybe stop them from beginning a (new) torrentsite. I mean the RIAA and MPPA close down sites and give the owners fines, ok, but these sceners go way further and are (if you ask me) way more succesfull.
the idea of a closed scene is wonderfull imo, I mean I see so much n00bs and insecure people these days. Scene/fxp/p2p is quite mixed these days, it’s sad. In the BBS age it was all far better, with nfo’s naming the affilsite and members, with the meetings. But that’s all over, the scene is insecure these days. No group will ever change that, because it’s worldwide and the whole way of thinking in the scene changed. From bloody serious and skilled to n00by and selfish.
The future is promised to no one!
I read the saga of the supertorrent.org admin. The scene is going after sites that ask for money just for the privilege of using the site. I see nothing wrong with the scene destroying these greedy fools. Some private torrent sites ask for donations, advertise and sell t-shirts in order to help maintain and improve their sites, but the supertorrent admin was asking for money (and a lot of idiots paid up the $10-20 he was asking) just for the “privilege” of using the site so they don’t risk getting banned. He was making a decent living offering stuff released by the scene. The scene is not against sharing, they are against profiting from other people’s work. It really is that simple. So down with those greedy private trackers.
#4 said it best.
p2p gets throttled by your isp whether you realize it or not. IRC is so much faster and more reliable. No torrent, or even any of these rlslog rapidshare links can touch IRC. p2p is for joe schmoe who doesnt know how to download efficiently anyways…
i guess this is what nerds do to each other
Rule 1 Never trust a thief
Rule 2 See rule 1
Any questions.?
@H00DLUM
Get a life…..
#37’s right on point
These idiots who are making money off the scene and contribute nothing can be taken out. I won’t shed a tear for any of those profiteering bastards.
seems like it was more efficient to use the Storm botnet to take out the trackers instead of outing names.
lol
my heart’s bleeding for the sceners… gimme a break… you steal, they steal, we all steal… who the hell cares?!?
facebook, lol
Damn kids lol..
J.
I agree 100% with #38 Howl4Me, I think he’s spot on. Besides who really cares about private torrents sites that consider themselves super duper uber “elite”?
Good. How about those torrent admins now give out detailed information about the FTP sites they source their uploads from?
This can get ugly. With insane fines and *prison* for both sides. What happened is a stupid thing cause the P2P sites under attack can take counter-action and expose scene sites. What the hell are they thinking?
No off topic just wondering why this hasn’t made the newspaper yet. You would think the MPAA and RIAA would be head over heels about this.
The real problem here is that the scener’s are elitest, they feel what they do is not theft of someones work but the sharing of the info among the other elitest. Like the hackers of the late 80’s & 90’s this is a repeating process. The old way never likes the new… our club is better, our version of god is better than yours… whatever rhyme or reason it takes to dislike or discriminate against others…. let them do their thing, and in the process let them perish… The scene hate because hate is truly fear… fear of loss of their identity, their collective… they fear aXXo, DXM, Leetay…. to name a few… true many non-sceners do rework someone elses work and claim it as their own.. giving no credit to the originator this is not right but at the same time gives others experience in doing the work at hand…. we mastered fire, walking, reading etc… by experimentation and trial and error… we were taught by those or guided by those who knew… yet as a species… we squabble over everything… I know that statistically speaking 15 people will flame me or call me some sort of idiot… because of this rant… yet do i care, will i go home and cry on my pillow… no… because like many of us who share here and elsewhere… we are above the childishness of the few who think they must defame others to feel superior… let them do what they must, but in the end… they are the ones who will think about it day in and out… not i, nor you… the best revenge is not giving one at all. Then you know 2 things are true… you are a better person than they who wronged you and that life is worth living and enjoying not spending every moment crying over spilt milk
Piracy has no rules end of story if you steal something then it can be stolen by whoever wants to steal it next.These sceners don’t own the media in the first place so why do they dictate who does what.I don’t really care to be honest.This guy should pay the sceners back with hardcore violence smack them around the head with there own keyboards.I don’t give a monkeys who grasses me in to whoever but always remember i’ll come after you no matter what or how long it takes revenge is always sweeter in the end.
@39 ha ha haha. And so says the great, all knowing elite one eh?
- you’re wrong and you know it.
.
at the end of the day the admin of the site was being a d1ck, getting all high and mighty and banning people for shareing files from his site that he had leeched elsewhere .. he deserved it for being a greedy so and so
& i dont blame the scene for hating on him or p2p users, a majority of BT users are blatently dumb stupid people constantly asking how to view this “file” and with what to open this “file” with etc etc even tho the answers already been posted 100 times! i think id be enoyed to think complete nubs were downloading my hardwork and moaning it dosent work when it blatently does
This sounds like some kind of hoax, and I’m not buying it for one minute. Especially not since the source is Mr. X.
If it was true, “next up, rlslog”.
BitTorrent blows and anyone who uses it is a newbie and deserves to get caught! It will be the death of the internet. Uses way to much resourses and doesn’t give back much.
LMAO!
What next? They hijack next admins sisters email and demand ransom?
I think these scene kids need more discreet approach…
Hire a hitman, bullet in the head makes usually quite good point!
I understand the basic “share but keep it secure” argument, but isn’t it obvious that P2P people provide a “front” for the sceners? Why should MPAA/RIAA/BSA/whoever mess around with some highly secretive ripper group whose name most people can’t even rememeber when they can publicy hang&burn some large torrent site or some well known BT site admin? “Website linking to thousands of movies that you could download by just installing a BT client was shut down by the police!” is *way* more provocative than “police caught a 10 people ’scene’ group that made available 30 movies last year”…
I believe the main problem here is having people making some money out of the scene’s hard work, isn’t it?
I think some sceners got their door knocked on by the MPAA or RIAA , but this is totally hipocritical . This reminds me : doesn’t this feel a bit like a “mob” war ? You stole from us , we’ll kill you , even if our loot was already stolen from someone else . These “sceners” are just being childish and are attracting too much attention onto the scene itself , probably they wanna get themselves caught . Peace . Secure scene ? Please stop me laughing
)
My best wishes in their crusade againt those hypocrital torrent sites.
First off, this information is not hard to get hold off anyway, in any country.
Maybe other then the ISP / I.P address + relatives information, other then that everything else is out there for the world to see, good look to Brandon, *hides in the corner and squeals with laughter*
//over and out.
Usenet FTW! Although id sometimes use torrents for those hard to find releases…
Quote from the comments @ torrentfreak:
“This is an interesting P2P sandwich, we’ve got the MPAA/RIAA pushing from the top and the hacker anarchists pushing from the bottom. Who knew the scene could get this complex and dramatic.
I wonder if it’s the pirates that actually sell content for money who are really behind these “outings”.
Right to the point.
i think some of you dont understand that the scene is non-profit. People who have p2p sites gain money from the scene. Thats why the dont like it.
lol
hmm my post didnt show up… anyways.. im all for the scene hunting sites gaining personal profit, but sites that gets fair donations and use them as donates should be used should be left alone..
as for scene vs P2P was in general, i think it will even out and we will have both except it will be one…
@ 64: How you do know it is not a myth, of course Bittorrent admins profit from advertising and donations, etc, but how do you know the scene doesn’t sell content, because it happens all the time, sceners selling silvers to others and then writing NFO’s saying “Only xxxx can use our video”, etc.
They buy the stuff and sell it on, they are only after p2p because they are paranoid.
this sounds like a credits war, “noo i ripped that and released it! not you, thats my illegal art work!” ect..
*hugs* Kad network
Mirror please? Sendspace sucks! RS!
This is a sad day for P2P.
This ain’t a scene, it’s a God damn arms race!
.-
Darren22, if the scene distributed to the majority, the p2p groups wouldn’t be needed?
I don’t get why anyone would want to change things because the fact of the matter is that if they try to take out P2P aka… bittorrent kazaa etc… people are going to turn to what ever still works which would end up being IRC which would make IRC get a lot more n00bs spamming and focusing more attention to IRC then they probably intended.
OK everybody shake hands and go to your respective corners… we are all on the same side in the end. The end will come to quickly with behavior such as this.
Awww some one took their ball away, didums.
Is this a new kind of War?
LOL “p2p will stop” yeah along with microsoft and google…
So is it only the private tracker sites that are being targetted?
i can see why the scene folk aren’t happy, why should people make money off their work?
or do they have a problem with P2P in general?
scuse the ignorance, clarification would be appreciated?
Arseholes
hahahaa classic!
now all of you are on notice!give respect where respect is due!@33 gets it, maybe you will too. Wake up, Time to Die!!!!
For those people that think IRC is untraceable think again, what these people and company fail to see that piracy of music and games and all over things have been around for ages you shut one down 4 other open up. Their fight a fight that cant be won. Simple as that…
tophos is next, melvin and his sisters are going ot die, one allready died, adam gets married at disney wed, cant wait
long live the scene rls’es on p2p and other sh**! we are all here to share EVERYTHING (well, maybe not GF’s)… so wtf is this all about??
i think this is wrong, wery wrong of those “Sceners” to destroy peoples work, some work wery hard to setup a site and then they just **** it over, well i can see that if they litterly stells scene release that was never made to get to the public then i think it is some reason in it.
how ever, i never use bit torrent cause it takes me to download a movie 2-3 days cause there is no seeders, or just only leechers, and when i have downloaded the movie in some hours it has a ratio of 12 or something, i mean wtf? i wait for 2-3 days so some leechers just get it fast and then just vanish from seeding the torrent? to hell with that, i like sharing but not just to seed to some idiot’s.
i hate the way bit torrent works on public sites, and those closed trackers, i will never get into them cause you need to do something special to one person you never meeted, or know someone.
i only download from rapidshare now, and upload, i love it cause it is fast and if you share enough it will never cost you 1 cent!
Hahaha.. As some already said:
“They steal from us! *cry* Hahaha, I almost pissed my pants reading these news.
I really do not understand these people
If they are in the scene and are upset that their releases got on p2p, well to bad
I wonder why most of the stuff I want is being served on private trackers, and sites I do not get signed in
If they think for just 2 minutes they will see that they are wrong to use some of their skills in the bad way
Just do all of us a favour and stick with the things u’r good at, don’t go and screw people over just because they are just doing the things u do but in an other way
@84 If you had a half decent BitTorrent client, you could limit your upload rate. Limit it until you finish seeding, then get a good ratio. Leech first, seed later. Use uTorrent, it’s easy. If you have a client good enough, and don’t know how to do this, you’re a bit of a n00b.
Site owners that charge for access so you can get your hands on scene releases are the same as bootleggers. They only use BT as a delivery system. If it weren’t P2P with BT or some other file sharing software it would be done by charging for access to private FTP servers or passworded IRC channels.
That said, publishing the names and addresses of site owners, their family members and friends is just plain dangerous. If one single person is harmed because of this, the person who published the names will be guilty of a violent crime. And if that happens you can forget about the RIAA and MPAA, because the FBI and Interpol with be on your asses and the least of your worries will be piracy charges.
Even if they never laid a hand on the people, those who published the information will have made it possible for others to do harm. Ignorance of the law or the “unknown or unintended” consequences of one’s actions will not be considered a plausible defense by most juries and judges.
The idea is that you could reasonably expect that the publication of names, addresses, phone numbers and other personal information would lead to financial damages, personal injury or psychological harm. Therefore, should anything happen, the original publisher would be liable as the instigator of a conspiracy.
scene extremist / scene terrorist = SCENARIST
The scene only have themselves to blame. If things are “INTERNAL” and get leaked – its because one of THEIR members leaked it. Same with uploading to shared FTPs with other groups – everything gets out because someone in one of the groups decides they want to share it with non scene people.. thats how it happens. If they don’t want their stuff leaked – then they should get their own house in order – so to speak.
Any scene group that does stuff like this and helps the RIAA/MPAA achieve their goal is a sellout.
@38, alright us joe-shmoes don’t know how to download efficiently… How about you tell us? Where can we find these so called “IRC” servers and how do we convince the elitist sceners, uploaders, top-site owners and IRC operaters to even let us read the TOPIC of their IRC
I’ve been looking for good topsites, IRC servers and FTP servers for a long time… And I haven’t been able to gain access to even 1. So stop complaining cuz I get fine speeds with bittorrent, downloading 4 gigs of stuff in under an hour..
Hey excuse my ignorance again, but why should private trackers hosty site people be able to take somebody elses work and make money off it,
The scene do not do what they do to make money do they,why should someone take what should be free and charge people for it?
or have i got it all wrong, do the scene people have a problem with pirate bay etc,
Pride comes before the fall
teh sc3ne is still angry because p2p cracked bioshock first, so they now act like n@zis.
I’m on many private trackers and have yet to pay any money.
The people that did this really need to get there priorities right.
hey wheres my last comment?
do the scene only want their releases to be seen by the scene so to speak?
just stop downloading useless nfo files with movies.. i consider them mostly as spam ..
Maybe an anti-piracy group is trying to
start a war between P2P sites and The Scene.
Thats scary!! :-O
ah and @ 71 (V) this aint a scene its a god damn arse face
-> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LucfKdukf10
“The scene is supposed to be secure, releases should stay within the scene and nothing is supposed to be made publict.”
So what you’re saying is, the people involved in the scene are a lot like the people who work for the RIAA?
Ahh i remember the good old days before p2p. now EVERBODY is doing it, and ppl get sued!
Tho their actions are lame. Shame on you!
I for one don’t trust anything that Muppet X says
so is that it, they spend all that time and effort just to get praised or nuked by their peers, whats the point in that, i thought it was a bunch a cool hippies, death to the man and all that,
maybe they should get out more!!
hey P2P frever man, well gettin stuff free frever man, death to the man, peace and love
The P2P system is the same as Scene? You give some, you get some.
Hey Mr X, do you think it was a racially motivated attack?
Any Sceners who agree with this pattern of behavior are only shooting themselves in the foot. P2P is a much larger, easily accessible public facing element of illegal file activity online. It acts as a shield basically, an easily identifiable and persuable target for law enforcement as opposed to the relatively difficult task of tracking down usenet and IRC users.
If anything, they should encourage P2P in order to remain all the more exclusive and under the radar.
#87 i have it limited while downloading, i only put it off when seeding. did you even read all i writed?
I wonder if all sceners are Virgins?
nfos are spam. Never read but for serials.
so wouldnt the next step be for some P2P people to make public scene people information,
are we going to war, are there any scene people here to provide their perspective
so where does axxo fit in this is he P2P or scene, and where is he anyway, and are you not allowed to mention his name here, oh dear mummy help!!!
go MAFIA(A)! make the bastards on the internet pay for lame media. increase the profits of the huge conglomerates!
anyone who steals for themselves aren’t really part of the scene, period. they are just plain thieves.
many powerful people have used their tremendous resources to try and stop P2P before… sometimes they get lucky and knock a site down, but we all know how this will turn out in the end
my thoughts go out to affected admins. rock on homies, you know what to do.
boys will be boys?
@ charlie
axxo isn’t scene, he was just some kid who rented movies when they officially came out and put them on p2p. anyways, he’s been out for a while. never had a problem with his releases, but not really having trouble finding stuff in his absence… don’t really miss him either.
why ty hobomobo, what a knowledgeable gentleman you are, im still havin a hard time believing that these scene people dont want people to see or appreciate their hard work, other than other scene people sayin,” hey i love what you did what that aspect ratio man, but im gonna nuke you for you audio”
oh well,
Take care
How do we know RIAA or a similar organization isn’t behind this?
so are you saying its aAF (your link)
easynews, you dont need newsleecher
I know first-hand what a security risk P2P (usually) is to the scene, and you can’t really blame them [the sceners] for wanting to protect themselves. After all, any Joe Schmoe can download some release over P2P, or even be high and mighty managing some torrent trackers and sites, but the releases wouldn’t be there without the providers, sometimes taking huge personal risks to provide their respective group with the release. They, and the rest of the team that ensure that the release ends up on the groups hq and trickles all the way down to the “lesser” sites where they are eventually leaked off to P2P, are the ones that risk their jobs, money, and even freedom (in the sense of going to jail.)
I think the scene could do with an greater increase in security, even though most sites and irc channels these days are top-notch, using SSL, proxies, and thorough examination of every user added. In the end, any security compromise affecting the scene will in some way or another affect the P2P community as well, seeing how P2P, as a phenomenon, in most cases just act like a leech to a host. I don’t mean that in a bad way — I support P2P all the way, for getting the stuff out there, to everyone, not just to the selected elite. I just think it’s up to us (P2Pers) to be respectful to the scene’s need for privacy and security. We might need to be more careful with posting sensitive NFOs, or other details of site(-ops) or such. These days the MPAA and DOJ guys don’t need to infiltrate the scene groups, they cant just hang around P2P and hope revealing details float their way.
Then again, you’re pretty stupid (as a scener) if you put revealing information in your NFOs and so on. But still, it happens every now and then, in flame-wars, or courier-group forums (anyone remember tca?) or such.
There’s no need for some stupid way. Just… be respectful — both ways. If the scene should come crashing down, then at least let it be at the hands of those sneaky government and anti-piracy bastard — don’t do their work for them.
come on, get a life guys… this is a bit sad, anyway who cares
Lol@bad information…
This would’ve been a successful follow up article
if you didn’t get all the facts twisted.
uFAIL
jihad?
p2p is going to go down, and it should, its been leeching off the scene for too long
please go after tophos . org next pleaseplease go after tophos . org next pleaseplease go after tophos . org next pleaseplease go after tophos . org next pleaseplease go after tophos . org next pleaseplease go after tophos . org next pleaseplease go after tophos . org next pleaseplease go after tophos . org next please
XDCC Ninja Death Squads are coming
Very, very interesting read Mr. X.
What I don’t understand is why the sceners are annoyed, when they preach about the ‘right’ to free media, and try to promote it as best as possible, but then go on a huge retaliation when people are doing just that, redistributing their work.
I understand where they are coming from.
It is they who go to all the trouble to get the movie, game, application, etc. Then to crack it or re-encode it and upload it. Then have someone come along and ’steal’(much too harsh a word) their work.
Are they not(in effect) doing the same thing? Stealing someone elses work?
These so called ’sceners’ are nothing but a bunch of whiny little kids who have nothing better to do than to break apart the network their comrades built. What a bunch of idiots. They are trying to expose admins of large p2p sites, the kind of people who would have access to the idents of the sceners themselves. Idiots.
Found this article via Goog… Its a slighly better info’d article about the start of the p2p attacks…
Apparently Sceners attacking Direct Connect (DC++) hubs too.
DATE:
Tuesday, December 13, 2005
TITLE:
P2P Networks under attack.. from The Scene
On Saturday, a notice was posted to the scene containing information about a swedish group called SMURF and a private DirectConnect hub with a few thousand users. The author of the notice complained that too many people in The Scene had gotten involved with P2P networks, and that these involvements was a huge security risk for The Scene. The reason, they stated, is that authorities have started to view P2P as a bigger threat than The Scene itself. The author then complained that members of the group SMURF was leaking releases directly to the hub (even before pre), and attached was nicks and IP addresses to people from The Scene involved with the hub, the complete user list of the hub (with IP addresses) and screenshots. This, of course, forced the DC hub to shut down. The notice also complained about people in the scene who only release custom subs, sometimes without asking permission from the group behind the original release.
Following this, several more private DC hub was attacked in a similar fashion and an uploader to the swedish bittorrent community swebits.org was revealed. Now it seems The Scene is going after two more internationally known bittorrent communities:
Warnings go out to bittorrent trackers including torrentbytes and scenetorrents, we have a LOT of information on both of these trackers, this is their chance to shut themselvies down and get as far away as they can. efterbliven which was exposed by someone other than us has asked for his account to be deleted on torrentbytes, shame that someone revealed just one person in 1 notice.. we got a whole list of irc nicks and ips for that stuff.. *scratches efterbliven off list*
So what does The Scene ultimately want? It seems they want to cut all direct connections to any P2P network. They’re even going after members who have a site on one server, and a box connected to a P2P network on another server with a different IP. Do they want to cut all connections to P2P networks altogether? From the notices it almost seems so, but there are probably different opinions within The Scene. Someone even released a counter-notice:
Nobody could have missed the latest events on the scene. Where a bunch of narrow minded,
jolt-cola drinking nobodys claim to have full copywright of pirate material. So, I wonder,
makes you think that you are any better than the average p2p-user? Just because you leech from
ftp, and others from DirectConnect
My personal opinion is that The Scene is overreacting. As they’ve stated themselves, the anti-piracy bureaus don’t care much about The Scene anymore, it’s the P2P networks that are doing the real damage. Another thing to note is that most busts to The Scene seem to be direct busts. I can imagine that crawling through a network of private DC hubs and torrent trackers would take some time. And what would be the point of rushing releases if it doesn’t go out to anybody, with the exception of members of The Scene, who one would think spend all their time rushing releases. The notices they’ve released so far give the impression that the releases should only go out to people who contributes. I have respect for The Scene because of the risks they’re taking, but if they remove all risks by not letting the content flow down the P2P hierarchy, then they’re essentially nothing. And surely shutting out all members involved in P2P poses a security risk in of itself. Some of them will probably be pissed about being shut out of The Scene, and would be more likely to give anonymous tips to anti-piracy bureaus. Although they’ve been shut out, any leak of information is a potential security risk.
What The Scene probably should do, is have a few groups who act as accepted proxys between The Scene and the P2P networks. If done properly, it should pose no major security risk. Instead, they accept no connections to the P2P networks at all, making it more likely for members with a different opinion to upload releases to P2P in an unorganized and insecure fashion.
———–End Of Article———
this is just another example of sceners making themselves feel important.Lets start a war,first of all wars are fought by men not losers who still havnt opened the pack of condoms dad gave them on their 16th birthday.
and it seems like they forget all there doing is modifying something that already exists, like if i change the words to a song that doesnt make it mine
im on a couple private trackers and have never paid a cent,donations are asked for not required and i still have access to all the torrents (even if i have fewer download slots then someone who donated)that other members do.
the only way to view something like this is abunch of sad little hypocrits who steal anothers property then whine like little b*tches when someone takes it from them.
they claim its about security but put thereself in the line of fire by doing something so childish and stupid. are they really so naieve to think there will be no backlash i hope someone puts these sad little pieces of sh*t in their place
the “scene” hate it or there released to be public and shown by everyone for example a NFO by HATRED
“HATRED does not respect any p2p networks, NFOrce or
anything to make the scene more public.”
that means they dont really want this site to exist cause we are exposing all scene releases and all that
baa humbugs , just have to go back to trying to do it all myself
takes a lot lot longer but F them if they think there sh1t dont stink like the rest of us 
ps, but if it scene only how it end up on p2p in first place? must be someone in there ranks that lets it onto p2p so they need to weed out the spies on there scene , that just might help a bit :p
They do what they have to. I was in he scene for some years and I can tell you we would ban any group members that spread the releases.
The scene was never about spreading releases to the world. It was about sharing them between groups only. example: you have access to new DVDs, and your best friens has access to Software and knows how to crack. You guys exchange your material only between you and no one has a problem. But if your friend decides to put your ripped DVDs in the internet and spread it to the world, you are the one in trouble because the authorities will do whatever it takes to catch you, and believe me during those years I was in the scene there was major busts every year. So many good people in jail, so many groups gone. :/
They only wish not to be noticed because it’s their lives and their safety.
I dont remember Robin Hood going after anyone he found passing on his free food for the poor, so why have the scene turned into baddies?
Sure if the torrent sites were selling warez then thats a bad thing but there not???
Im scared im gonna hide under my bed til its all over.
I dont remember Robin Hood going after anyone he found passing on his free food for the poor, so why have the scene turned into baddies?
Sure if the torrent sites were selling w@rez then thats a bad thing but there not?
Im scared im gonna hide under my bed til its all over.
I dont remember Robin Hood going after anyone he found passing on his free food for the poor, so why have the scene turned into baddies?
Sure if the torrent sites were selling w@rez then thats a bad thing but there not?
I dont remember Robin Hood going after anyone he found passing on his free food for the poor, so why have the scene turned into baddies?
Dumb_dumb_dumb_kiddies.
I dont remember Robin hood going after anyone he found passing on his free food for the poor, so why have the scene turned into b@ddies?
i love this response to the article i posted above (#127)
“The Scene operates by having one weakness in a media company – one people in a million leaks one copy, and a release group gets a release.”
“Now, they’re complaining because it’s happening to them – one weakness in the scene releases a release to a p2p network and the p2p sites get a release. ”
So true so true.
I can remember when sceners were heroes, not spotty little jockstrap sniffers hiding in their bedrooms…
I believe the scene should work harder and provide as freely more cracked/ripped content.
i see your point Unleashed hmm well scene or no scene there will always be 1 way or another for getting the stuff same as mpaa an all them stop this an that an block this an that , there always be a way around , the scene do the best rips of games an all that but there p2pers out there that can do well enuff so !!
long live p2p an sceners an let the war begin , i am up for a lafe
Dear Mr MPAA,
We sceners would like to bring to your attention, the ‘p2p’ sites that are on the internet stealing our releases that we have stolen from the ‘Big Media’, they are stealing our media and making it available to other people saying it is theirs.
Please could you shut them all down, so we can continue to make ‘Silvers’ to sell to the Russian Mafia, before they come and ‘take care of us’.
Many Thanks
The Sceners
PS. Thnx for all the leeked movies.
I can download this is movie? Howda kualiti? Super duper or no no?
So.. why did you copied the artice word-by-word from Torrentfreak?
http://torrentfreak.com/sceners-threaten-to-destroy-bittorrent-080107/
(I know you will probably want to censor it and delete it and stuff.. but whatever)
ppl from the scene are livin in a lu abre lusion tin dem a deal wid
this is very strange , no way in the old days would any sceners attack people in this way ,
ok what you must remember back when it all started big time back in the late 80s with the amigas it was basicly the same as now but no internet as such; disk where not hard to get hold of ,i had 100s of releases ,so really all the p2p has done is advertise the fact , i cannot beleive that a scene group would do this , most probley the man upstairs with the help of the riaa, mpaa etc doing it , but then again i aint be in the scene for a long long time ,you never would have done anything like this and if you did you certainly would not advertise the fact that your doing it lol , maybe the scence is full up with kiddies now that dont understand the rules ,or RESpect each other like the olddays , i personnally think that these attacks are not from the scene they are a way for the riaa to take down the bt sites with out the months of work they need to do and of course they have to do it legal ,this way they dont and blame it on the scene for doing it ,i dont know i have great respect and trust for the scene and the people init and i truly belive that these arnt true sceners if they are what is the world comming too..?
well if you think about it,
The Scene trying to .. Kill .. Bitorrent, or P2P. is like the MPAA attempting to shut down The Pirate Bay.
in the end, they end up with a bullet in the foot.
That are very good news!! Destroy P2P!!
Long live UseNet!!
As long as aXXo will come out with DVDRips, this doesn’t matter. It’s funny to watch these folks digging their own grave though.
rqqt,
I haven’t seen an aXXo release for months.
where do you get yours?
Hm?
“the day p2p died”
…sounds like a hollywood movie
pig crap
at last they are doing something. GO SCENE’s!!! im with you not using any p2p progs… <—props some here i visit this site for the news on releases ect. but p2p sux & is very insecure i use stuff that cant be commented on
roflmao,
“We have yet again erased another torrent admin from existence. Other Groups, do your part to make the scene what it was in the beginning. Secure.”
the scene has never been secure. first got involved in the early to mid nineties. as long as humans are involved it will never be secure. i prefer torrents these days so you don’t have to get involved in the stupid politics.
relax, enjoy
The scene hasn’t been secure for a long ass time. If I remember correctly, it was pretty secure before all the DMCA laws were passed. Soon after, crackdowns on the scene started. The scene had major raids against before bittorrent/P2P erupted. Thier reasons for doing this is stupid, makes no sense and will never make the scene more secure. Times changed… adapt or GTFO… bittorrent/P2P is gonna be around if you like it or not.
@Projectil3
From a private, elite, payed VIP membership on a p2p site. Where else?
I don’t buy it for a second that these are people on the scene doing this! This is just RIAA or MPAA at work, pretending that credit should go elsewhere for the damage. You don’t really believe that the RIAA or MPAA would go and take credit for this, do you? It would cause them more trouble then it is worth. Besides, Wwhat better way to assist in the destruction of the scene then to instigate p2p’ers to do it to each other? Divide and conquer— this is an old game with a new twist.
My 2 cents.
So the mpaa and riaa are making there moves within the scene.. interesting. Wonder how much there getting paid to attack fellower p2p’ers. This war wont last long..
Screw the scene, it’s mostly filled with the REAL pirates who sell the stuff and funnel the money into other criminal activities anyway. I wish that the scene WOULD die…
P2P’ers.. you know, the SHARERS, would get our stuff anyway, sure it wouldn’t be prerelease but we’d get it on or after release and we wouldn’t even notice the loss of “early” stuff after a while (we’d even end up cracking it ourselves.. BIOSHOCK anyone? even “teh scene” stole that one), and that way the companies might make more of a profit which might shut them up a bit. It’s in EVERYONE’S best interests if the scene were to disappear.
Die, scene, DIE!
@157
“Divide and conquer— this is an old game with a new twist.”
An interesting theory.. although I personally wouldn’t give the RIAA or MPAA that much credit. You really think they’re that smart?
Looks like Wibble’s the next to be hacked lol
As for me, I’m 100% behind whoever poses the biggest threat lol
this article isn’t accurate.
i agree w/ #147
The CIA does the same thing, using the mafia for (domestic) things they don’t want a connection to.
I think the MPAA/RIAA/BREIN saw aAF’s comment & saw an opening. Psych-ops, corporate style.
Scene is secure, you don’t think they actually use their own paid for connections do you? They use other hacked connections which they control through another hacked connection. Degrees of separation are what create security. But that also creates complexity, complexity which most of hte P2P sharers don’t want to be hassled by. P2P relies on security through numbers. Power of the people. The RIAA/MPAA/BREIN rely on laws & shame, on the public mis-perception of public perception of ostracation.
Only through a larger audience will any “sharing” ever be tolerated. Media companies know that, which is why they’re pushing so hard for digital distribution. Controllable sharing, microtransactions. They know they cant stop P2P, so they’re going to try to make a more convenient system for a fee.
?
Lol, JC… I’m quaking.
All “teh scene” is, is a kiddie fiddling, porn distributing organised criminal fratenity anyways… screw them.
Captilistic,non sharers.
Unite comrades unite.
I wish we could go back 10-15 years on the internet, not so much god damn children and spammers around making a mess of things. Them good old days, you’ll never forget them.. I’m happy to have atleast experienced them.
Such behavior is childish. They didnt just remove the p2p from the picture, they destroyed the lives of these people. The LIVES. They have no other life to retreat to when such things happen. These REAL people are stuck living through the rest of those lives, haunted by what these self-gratifying asholes have done to them. There is no justification for that. Ill be damed before I see people praising what they have done! Nobody deserves this…
It has actually come down to this? LOL
THIS behavior is what will kill all sharing.
I have an idea.How about the ‘Scene’ worry more about putting out something that doesn’t need to be properd’ 8 times than where it goes.How about looking over outdated ’scene rules’
Who made “The Scene” sharing gods anyway? Those who leech don’t really give to $hits who it is coming from anyway.Just that they can get by any means necessary.
get a life
let p2p and shareing on the internet thrive!
gotta say…. I agree, these dumb torrent and p2p newbies are out of control. I haven’t used P2P since 2002. I remember back when the “sceners” were attacking the aol “server/cerver” rooms like this.
Now, we all know that a few bad seeds will always reside in every population. It’s not fair to punish the whole of P2P network because of a few bad people.
Both the sceners and P2P are on one side and already have a great big resistance from RIAA/MPAA. So why make the situation even more conducive for a total wipe-out of both P2P and Sceners by the hands of MPAA/RIAA. The only people who would benefit from this are these f*cktards MPAA/RIAA.
We all want freely flowing data in the end which does not cost a cent. So peace guys, before we shoot one another over this.
You know… I am glad #120 said it. I was thinking the same thing.
I read most the comments about how lame the Sceners are against P2P and how “automatically” people here assumed negatively about them. There seems to be a very few that would think like #120 and I.
I would have to think that this may be a NEW strategic move implemented by big corp IN HAND with Government(s). You have to remember, it would not be far thinking that this “black” circle would hire l33t black-hat hackers for near top dollar.
N0085 listen up… Some of you know that the scene would like to think of themselves as gods giving us what we can not afford to obtain. So in essence, P2P and scene really walk “hand in hand”. Without us being thankful for what they hand down to us, they really have NO reason to do what they do. The scene loves the “Robin Hood” attention they get from us and I for one am REALLY thankful that they are brave for sharing such items. But if you think about it, this is just a ploy to create 1) Division 2) Fear (OMG I GON GET CATCHED) 3) Panic (See #2).
I do not fear government (watch V for Vendetta people) and I am not easily divided.
But a word of advice, Rlslog needs to start a registration “campaign” complete with user name and password and true secure servers.
N0085, carefully read what the experienced has posted pertaining firewalls and related stuff. A sponsorship program between n00b and those with knowledge would be nice. It definitely would be the first of its kind.
Everything with a grain of salt people.
N07 57UP1D
theres no need for that new sort of war.this sucks.sooner or later when sth goes out live it will be later found on these common p2ps or any new whatever u wanna call it network.bottom line sharing is what we should care about using any way possible.its u the end user that should pick out the way u wanna share and download.
peace
You are all newbs, learn how to use something besides torrents, its only a matter of time before all torrents are capped by ISPs,
What kind of pathetic person would post someones name email, address and ip……….o wait…..Isn’t that what happened here at rlslog?
Not stupid.. you ARE stupid!
“I for one am REALLY thankful that they are “BRAVE FOR SHARING SUCH ITEMS”.”
WTF??????
The scene isn’t some bunch of altruistic Robin Hood types as you like to portray them… (mostly) they are the shady thugs who stand at markets and SELL digital copies of anything under the sun… it’s done for purely profit motives (you have to buy your way into the scene, either with money or more releases) and the money is channeled into other less savoury activities… they (for the most part) are involved in highly organised criminal activity!!
THEY ARE THE PEOPLE WE ARE ACCUSED OF BEING!!!
Get a grip!
….so no one wants a waffles invite then?
LOL
the only way they can stop P2P is to stop “stealing” things themselvesand releasing them.
My private site got hacked over xmas and lost all its torrents, there was a mass upload week then….
It wont stop torrents
He was born one day after my girlfriend.
Paying for a service you can get for free.
Amusing.
the scene was a non profit see wat i can do , but i agree with wats being said , p2p are taking massive profits from the sceners who do it for money , i mean why pay a fiver for a dogey copy of a dvd for a few $$ when u can d/l it urself , but more and more im certain this attack is not scene or not old skool sceners due to the fact all that’s really been achieved is an increased awareness of the scene.
Practically overnight articles and links to articles about the scene have been posted on forums and blogs across the net, people who’d never even heard of “the scene” are now fully clued up. Yay!
zer0drew,
Perhaps you are the newb ! ISPs have already started that and 2 have already admitted to doing so….to ALL P2P
Don’t ASSume everyone here is using P2P/Torrent either.Thats just ignorant.
Some are saying for others to learn to use other means.Well lets see.Someone wants a file/app for FREE, do you think they want to PAY in order to get FREE files?
This is all lame and will pass over.If this ‘Scene’ guy really did do this then he will get his.What comes around, goes around
All that’s really been achieved is an increased awareness of the scene.
Practically overnight articles and links to articles about the scene have been posted on forums and blogs across the net, people who’d never even heard of “the scene” are now fully clued up. Yay!
If we ever needed proof the scene is full of children…
Also:
>IRC (untraceable)
PAHAHAHAHAHA
its no ploy the scene cant stand p2p and p2p wishes they could be part of the scene, its sad
I FULLY support the scene and ONLY the scene. If P2P die tomorrow, i couldn’t care less, honestly.
Zergrush kekekekeke , p2p , ftp usernet or what ? i still think
“no profit” shall stand.
****
Hey everyone… We have a troll and its name is Wibble. You guys/gals oughtta read its comments and see thru the BS it spills. ROFL!
Granted that they are shady and “black market” material, but there ARE a few other sceners that DO NOT mind of their warez “trickling” down to where we are… P2P. I dont deny this at all, so I am really Not Stupid, am I now? Just critically thinking on my part and pointing out that sceners would NOT do this sort of thing to DRAW ATTENTION to themselves!
Wibble is an idgit!
All i have to say to whoever said this…………
**** *** *** ****** *****
“p2p is going to go down, and it should, its been leeching off the scene for too long”
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
THE SCENE WAS NEVER SAFE, THE MPAA MAY NOT KNOW WHO THEY ARE BUT I GARUNTEE YOU IF PEOPLE IN THE SCENE ARE NOT PART OF SOME MAJOR CULT THEY WOULD HAVE GONE DOWN A LONG TIME AGO, IT’s JUST THAT HAVN’T YOU NOTICED THAT MPAA IS ALWAYS MAD THAT IS BECAUSE RICH PEOPLE OWN EVERYTHING AND IT BENEFITS MASON’s THAT THESE SCENE RELEASES LEAK, EVERYTHING IS ABOUT MONEY. SCENE DON”T HAVE TO GO THROUGH **** TO GET THEIR RELEASES. I USED TO BE IN THAT SWEDISH DIRECT CONNECT HUB, AND I TALKED TO SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE, THEY SAID THE BIG COMPANIES GIVE THEM THE RELEASE’s, Warners, Universal, and all of that! THEN IT DOESNT LEEK TO p2p UNTIL THEY GET THE GO AHEAD, IT LIKE CHINA and AMERICA, and Russia, WERE ALL SPIEING ON EACH OTHER!
Note’s
GOD BLESS BILL MOYER!
Just a little add to before I go eat.
IT’S ALL ABOUT MONEY!! SCENERS MAKE IT AS THEY CAN WITHOUT GETTING CAUGHT AND WITHOUT DRAWING ATTENTION TO THEMSELVES SUCH AS THIS. THIS IS ABOUT THE RECORDING INDUSTRY AND MOTION PICTURES GROUP LOSING THEIR MILLIONS!!
We as P2P support them by coming here and dl’d what’s being offered BY THEM (sceners) and some of us go as far as paying for accounts to UseNet and such! Think people!
Now I am hungry.
@ 160 — ( ¤ Y ¤ )
I don’t think they are that smart– I just think they have the deep pockets to hire smart (but unscrupulous) people who can hack this stuff and are willing to do it for the money.
People here really believe this was done by other people on the scene? I’m telling you man, that’s just what the RIAA and the MPAA want you to think! When all else fails, these people hope they can get the scene to tear itself apart, since the RIAA hasn’t been able to tear the scene apart with their own efforts.
A bit of history— when you had the famous Nixon era Watergate burglary that led to his impeachment as President, the burglars did all they could think of to make it seem like it was a standard burglary of an office. They didn’t want anyone to suspect that it was not really a “burglary”, but rather, an instance of political espionage. People attempting to do the ‘wrong thing’ always try to see if they can point the finger elsewhere
Stupid..
If you grant that what I’m saying isn’t false (which you do), and assuming that you read the word “mostly” in my post.. then I guess that I am neither trolling (btw these days calling someone a troll says more about YOU than it does about the “troll”) nor posting BS.. so I guess that “critical thinking” isn’t one of your strong suits.. care to rethink your statement on not being stupid?
ALSO.. this is EXACTLY the type of thing some “militant sceners” would pull.. this kind of anti-p2p sentiment has been brewing for many, many months which you would know had you actually read some of the nfo’s. I’m not saying that it is unlikely that “the man” is behind this situation, HOWEVER, I AM saying that knowing the amount of publicity that this will gather and how easily it would be for the scene to refute this action, that it is FAR MORE LIKELY that it IS in fact scene who are behind this.
BTW shouting “Hey everyboy, look at this”.. kinda sucks!
The “Scene” is actually groups who are basically trying to get themselves arrested by creating enemies. They are trying to end file-sharing.
Quoted from a comment at Torrentleech…
From the site in question.
At least two members of CELLKiLL sell ftp leech, I find that funny considering they talk about being secure.
Here’s one member..
KENNETH BIGLEY
23 W Haywood Ave
Struthers OH, 44471
330-755-4791
I know a member of the behind the scenes (no pun intended :p) staff of SuperTorrents personally and feel that the people at ST by no means force anyone to pay for use of the site, I admit I do not know the full staff or even most of them but those who I do know are certainly not driving around in $50,000 cars bought with the money from donations. Like almost all private trackers donations are voluntary and on many smaller sites the donations either barely cover server fees etc. or the admins/staff pay from their own pockets to make ends meet.
The larger sites however are a different story, isohunt for example (an indexing site I know), has seen overall donations for the site well in excess of $100,000 over just the past couple of years. SecretSquirrel got himself a shiny new BMW out of asking for donations. I don’t agree that these sites are right to make such large sums of money from what is essentially someone elses hard work (both the copyright owners and the release groups) however people are again not being forced to pay these funds, they do it out of thanks to the people who have provided them with the warez.
I have no doubt that if the scene groups were to run in such an open way as isohunt does then they too would be making huge amounts in donations as people would rather optionally donate $10 for downloading Adobe CS3 etc. than pay nearly $2000 for it. But then the ’scene’ wouldn’t really be as ’scene’ any more would it?
Long live the scene but long live p2p. Both have their place in the piracy community and both tender to different parts of that community.
LOL why dont these so called “Scene” pussies go after TPB? because TPB will laugh in their faces, thats why. Long Live TPB!!
Blackdeath..
You should go back and read the full story!
Secretsquirrel paid for the car mostly (by a long way) from the payment of actual real work that he was owed.. and for the small few thousand $ that was a donation, he made it perfectly clear that that was want he wanted it for.. those who donated knew he wanted a car.. SS even posted a pic of it for us to see… The way you wrote the post sounded as if you were saying that it was syphoned off on the sly or misappropriated.. which wasn’t the case.
HH.
@none [53]: I totally agree.
“, do your part to make the scene what it was in the beginning. Secure.”
Isn’t the point making things “unsecure” ?
I have no problem believing these are “sceen” attacks for a min. Been there and seen it before in other ways. When IRC channel back on DALnet you would see groups like #warez_ftp and #warez-ftp do what ever they could to shut down each others channels. I left the sceen along time ago when kazaa first came out because it brought it all to the masses. But what they are doing now is going too far. Its not just the admins they are messing with by exposing them its their famlies as well. People who have a “hobby” that is theft and against the law should be really careful who they piss of because not all p2p are just little script kiddies and a few of them are gonna fight back. SOOOOO glad I live in usenet and just poke my head out everynow and then.
In no way did I mean that SecretSquirrel had syphoned funds from isohunt, by saying ‘asking for donations’ I meant exactly what you’ve said above, that he made it very obvious what the donations were for and was very open about the matter.
My opinion of the matter is SS has done a lot of excellent work at IH and elsewhere. I believe the donations he recieved were well deserved and well spent too :p.
Apologies for anyone misguided by my vague statements.
What a bunch of pr1cks these so-called “scene” jerks are. We got news for you pricks, 99% of downloaders DO NOT GIVE A RATS A$$ about “scene” and by doing $hit like this you’re just making yourself look like a bunch of jerk nerds with no life and probably no girlfriends. Grow t.f. up pr1cks. If you don’t like it go find something more useful to do with your lives instead of trying to ruin others who are often providing a free service to many more people than you losers have done.
Those Axs whipes! They should go to hell and live there forever!
#14
“sorry. but what is p2p”
Are you on the right website?
If these scene groups really wanted to be secure, and not draw attention to themselves, they wouldn’t put out the childish and pointless .nfo’s and wouldn’t be so damn eager to put their “scene name” all over everything.
LONG LIVE TPB YOU FOCKERS WILL NEVER STOP THE PIRATE BAY, even though i rarely use the pirate bay do to very slow speeds of their masesses! Loooooooooooooooooool
Oh and please stop with the bs “our release” here’s another reality bite: YOU didn’t write the software. You didn’t make the movie. You didn’t write the game. Cracks and copies being made available are NOT the same as “hey look i made this great movie!” or “I’m proud to present Terminator 2 which was ALL my own work!” Get over yourselves. Cracks and copies are appreciated but hell no way majority who see it don’t kiss the person who “released” it foot.
After reading all this I believe some of the main points are:
1) Profiting from Scene is BAD, taking down those who profit is fine in my opinion.
2) Sharing is not bad, but should be done in a way so that the source scener/grp is not punished for it by the FBI, RIAA, MPAA etc.
3) Seems like it was only a small group of people who attacked the admin, if it wern’t, why had it not been done earlier?
The “scene” doesn’t want people who are a risk for them (BT users and basically other noobs who ask what a .TAR file is). Also, for those of you complaining about not being able to get into topsites, irc, and other ftp sites… you don’t deserve to be in. Your not tryin hard enough
, the “scene” is unsecure enough to where any joe schmoe can pay for axx.
my2cntz
@211
you get that?
True they didn’t “MAKE” the app or tv show, BUT they did bring it to you and took a risk in that so that you could have THEIR Quality, instead of some sh!tty crack that doesn’t work. If these people didn’t exist, you would pretty much have CRAP releases all around.
So let them dictate what they want to happen with the stuff they bring you. If you can’t wrap you head around what I’m saying, don’t worry.
Let me just put it this way.. those apps they didn’t make, wouldn’t work without the crackz they DO make.
Quote from NHS.
“1) Profiting from Scene is BAD, taking down those who profit is fine in my opinion.”
What about when it’s the scene themselves who profit? Are you saying that it’s ok for them to make money on copyrighted material that doesn’t belong to them?.. and as most of the dodgy market copies actually originate from the scene, is it ok for them to make a profit that way?.. what about the profit they make from having to buy your way into the scene, money or releses (which again leads to more profit).
Making profit from other peoples work (real creativity not “cracks or hacks”) is sh*tty and the scene has been making profit for far longer and has more connection to organised crime than p2p (who basically give it away for free.. i.e SHARING) ever will.
As far as I’m concerned the scene is a far less worthy or desirable institution than P2P.. isn’t not even is if they “give us” (lol) stuff that we wouldn’t get access to sooner or later anyway.
The scene now is unneccessary, and quite frankly unwanted by the majority of P2P.
The ‘clan’ that downed Torrentfreak are a bunch of english cowards (a trait inbred in that country). It was all over a well known p2p forum. They must feel very content know, shagging their sheep up north.
“The scene now is unneccessary, and quite frankly unwanted by the majority of P2P.”
LOL
Oh yeah, having to rely on p2p users actually getting to work, how great that would be!!
It’s true we’re so sick of seeing every tv show released for free the same day they were broadcasted on at least 3 different formats (SD,HRHD,720p), with strict standards on quality to ensure consistency, how ennoying this is..
And don’t let me start on movie screeners and 0day cracks, what a major pain…
MORON
Hardly….
If the scene didn’t do it, you can bet your @ss P2P would pick it up, as for quality., I’ve seen plenty of p2p stuff with equal quality.. and with widescale kudos to be earned there’d be a hell of a lot more, capping (for example) is hardly the most complicated thing in the world… and there are certainly crackers available. (lol, Bioshock)
Scene is convenient because they do the work, but if they disapeared, all we’d miss is their biitchin’.
4FuK-S8kZ, All this sh1t about who stole from who and who release first is bu11sh1t!!! “The scene” is behaving like the MPAA. Major Pile of Arogant A55h0les – FuK the scene!!
You cannot control the internet…
This sort of crap has been going on since the days of the C64. Here’s a thought; Why not omit the NFO and delete the part of the filename that carries the group’s name when the release is spread to P2P? P2P gets the file and nobody knows what group is responsible. Or create a fake group name that’s only used when the release is leaked to the P2P networks.
Of course all the groups are too full of themselves to ever release anything without their name on it, because then how would all the lamers of the world know how superior they are?
The way in which they chose to punish this guy seems somewhat counter productive. If anything can be learned from action taken by organisations such as the RIAA or MPAA, its that it simply doesn’t work. Within two weeks ten sites… ten greedy, money hungry admins will have replaced this guy. Increasing the demand for new torrents and increasing the temptation for ‘scensters’ to make a little extra kudos, or even money, by leaking scene releases. Not to mention the fact they will all start to get nervous, wondering who is next to be ousted as a leek. Next thing you know everyone’s watching everyone, no one is sharing , BAM! ‘the scene’ is dead on its arse, rotten from the inside out.
MPAA 1 – 0 The People
Wibble: LOL, If the “scene” didn’t exist it would take you a very LONG time to get a low quality copy of a show. Trust me, all these rls’s come from them, if the “scene” were to shutdown you would’nt get 1/100th of the crap your getting now.
And as far as them profiting from ftp leech slots, like I said it is wrong, and those people are mostlikely not the real sceners. Sceners actually LOSE money, to pay for DVD SCR, and SOMETIMES dedicated servers. First get an idea of things work, then speaks plz. If you still don’t understand, then just don’t worry. kthnxbye
Wibble, you are so talented to nit picking 1 (one) sentence out of a whole paragraph to prove people wrong and pointing out YOUR point of view and how misguided OUR opinion’s our.
Don’t guide us in YOUR way of thinking. I really do not want to be in your shoes right about now talking about the scene the way you are now. Remember, you are on Rlslog… The site that posts releases FROM the scene.
My end of this discussion on this topic is closed. Troll someone else Wibble. And yes, I did call YOU (Wibble) a troll. Not me or anyone else. Try to use your new founded jedi psychology on someone else.
Stick a fork in me, I’m done.
i think sceners are fed up when…dumbasses like axxo takes their releases..an then take the credit…i hope he’s next
NHS..
yep as I’ve said, we can forget all about quick releases (for a certain amount of time anyway, til p2p caught up.. which I’m pretty certain it would.)
Although I can’t agree that quality would suffer, yes, there would be those who couldn’t do it properly but would try anyway.. but also there would be those who would be “legends” and would be known for quality, so it would probably level itself out… Oday stuff and screeners would probably (for the most part) disappear, but we’d get them occasionally which would make them that much more special, as opposed to now where the majority of “us” seem to expect, nay, demand them. :O.. and we’d most certainly get used to not getting things early.. which would also (probably) have a positive knock on effect for the sales…
@Stupid…
Stick a fork in you I WOULD.
Isn’t that blackmailing?? Blackmailing is a criminal offense. LOL!
It was a foolish move to attack the p2p site admins. If could trigger counter attacks, that will compromise the security of the “scene” This was clearly the action of people with the childish mindset of valdals.
I completely agree with what the sceners are doing.
Bittorrent and P2P is all derived from the scene. Its like the Child.
The Child is getting the Father uncovered.
The scene is TRYING to stay Unnoticed. Put it this way.
If you were to take P2P and Bittorrent away, how would the average home user get there music and movies? They cant use IRC, Dont know wtf Usenet is, definatly dont have private sites. It just wont happen. Piracy would drop %70. RIAA/MPAA would back down, not completely, but slightly. Music/Cinema sales would increase. Everything would go back to how it was 10 years ago.
Quite Frankly, i would LOVE it if Torrent/P2P died. Would make my job (PC TECH) Alot easier, and alot less virus recoveries
I could give two poops about all this drama. P2P, a scene group, the Lord above, just release There Will Be Blood, Juno, We Own the Night, Beowulf, Michael Clayton that’s not missing four minutes and full-screen, any decent movie to fulfill my addictive nature for a night. TRON out.
***K Torrents!!! Hell yeah – FTP 4 Life!!! Scene 4 Life!! Screw these nubs!
It is really not that hard now-a-days to backtrack an e-mail or even a site. For instance one secret that not too many people know about is that you can spoof your headers, but you cannot spoof the nntp watermark that each computer places on e-mails and file transfers. with a few programs and simple time and effort, it is not that hard to back track to the site that hosts the page or even the server that your e-mail was sent from.
Once you have that info that is 99.9% of it as a few programs (that shall not be named) can trace what account sent what by just inputting the info a whosis search returns to you, thus giving you the real name and address of the person that owns the account or webpage where the traffic came from. Anyone that reads 2600 magazine already knows and has this information, not to mention should already know what programs I am talking about.
That being said, unless they are moving child porn; they should be left alone as it is very funny for one group that steals a screener to then complain that another group is making it available to the public. back in the day this was called ‘being a courier from top sites to distrib sites’ now I guess the people that are “seeding” the screeners are just too ignorant to understand that the torrent people are helping them.
No skin off the torrent people’s nose as what the sceeners really do not understand is that while it is easy for them to “out” the owners of the torrent sites, it is just as easy for the owners of the torrent sites to backtrack the sceeners and out them.
What goes around comes around.
A RAT IS A RAT IS A RAT IS A RAT
IMHO this is BS. if not then the tards behind it should be fried. -sigh-
Simple folks. Without one, the other dies.
I am and will always be grateful for the sceners. For without them, this ‘leech’ could not live.
-cheers-
Hmm….i dont understand these people…
)
Long live the piracy and long live freedom of internet (some
You’re all newbs, the same type of newbs who were paying for Dial-up and Compuserv Cause’ U didn’t know how to use BBSes and FreeNET
This thread here really shows the problem. So few people know much less care avout where w…z product comes, most aren’r t that new they just have no interest other than leeching. That is why so few in this thread can appreciate that many of the complaints from peeps in the scene are valid.
I come into a board like this where there is always a sub-text of gimme gimme from a sizwable chunk of the posts, yet those same people get all horrified that the people who devote hours of unpaid highly skilled labour aren’t all peace and love about it.
Even worse is the “what’s the big deal, people who steal complaining about people who steal?” line from the other ignoranises.
If you believe using w…z is stealing yet you still use it, what does that say about you ?
Try using your imagination and work out why it is that smart young puta-heads often with well paid gigs in the industry would risk everything to be dirst to beat the protection on a piece of software, and if it is really likely they would do that out of a sense of social responsibility to a mob of spoiled brats who happily blow $500 on a new graphic card with a built in obsolescence that will make it useless in 6 months, but who won’t spend $30 on a good game.
Please bow your heads for a short prayer….
Our leeching tho art from cyber,
Download be thy name.
Thy screeners come,
and thy dl’s be done,
On torrents as it is in Scene.
Give us this day our daily release
And forgive us our leeching
As we forgive those noobs who leech against us
And lead us not into Scene wars
And deliver us from Trojans
For thine is the Internet, the web, and the cyber
For ever and ever
Amen…
the issue is that too many people have access in the scene, and take rlses straight to p2p. this makes it easier for the law to link people and locations and arrest them. siteops won’t make the moves necessary to keep things secure so now we see the result. the problem is just 0sec though, if people could be satisfied with 0day then there’s no problem.
The Scene the scene the scene – Its supposed to be a free movement just like the p2p movement that are now complementing each other. I have no respect for the person from the scene who promptly did this as he brings down other sceners and users a long with it. It is also very degrading and unfair in return for what they consider ’stealing’ from them ultimately a hypocritical action. I can understand the frustration but the action was extreme and his skill exhausted for the wrong purpose. Just because you’re in the scene doesn’t mean you get let your head get too big and start acting draconian to the underling internet bodies.
Long live and PROSPER the SCENE and P2P.
In addition the user who had the problem with the p2p affiliate should have taken the matter with them. No one should have their private details broadcasted to the public as such.
Its sad to see how the people in the scene are used. They have no reasoning for the actions they are doing. Its stealing, plain and simple.
If they were to share it among the contriputors and friends, they could do just that. Nothing is stopping them for deleting themselves from topsites and to use own internal one to share the wealth. But they like the attention, which they get from the nfo’s.
It might be said, that the most efforts are done one the cracking sections of the scene ( 0day, applications and games ). I have always wondered, why do some talented people waste their time on stealing and doing work, which someone will 100% profit from. The risk of getting nerdish pride of being known as ubercracker cannot be explained, considering the danger of getting jail and being marked in the industry as a thief ?
I find it very interesting, that almost all p2p and scene talk involves the attitude as profiting being a “bad thing”. Its like some utopia they are trying to sell; “we cracked this and we didnt profit at all. Now we ask some respect and say you not to profit aswell.” But maybe they dont understand that, when they are stealing from some artist and sharing the art for free, the artist actually have to do something for a living, not like the majority of the “sceners” who probably got their mom cooking for them.
And what comes to trendy anti-corporation philosophy, they are feeding the same people in a different institution. All these corporations, who benefit from the piracy. And its the ordinary people who suffer in the long run.
There is no honor among thieves…
Its easy .
Scene releases are not made for the general public.They are made for the competing members in the different groups.
The fact that torrent uploaders are members on paytoleech sites and pay huge ammounts for their 0 day access does not mean that the Groups endorse them.
the pay-to-leech sites most of the torrent uploaders use to get their stuff are also frowned upon by the Scene .
The scene has always been internal , until torrents arrived.
And sry Mr.admin . Your point about Torrents gaining the sceners are just wrong . No real scene group get stuff from p2p people anyways . Thats why the p2p groups are banned in the scene ,mate ..
@ wibble: i see your point but i honestly think it’s a bit naïve…
Take movies for example, I need to use subtitles a lot (for me, girlfriend, parents…) and thanks to scene releases, everybody has a common denominator to work with, and it facilitates things A LOT.
Can’t imagine it working with “p2p releasers” when i see all these private torrents site, which all try to have exclusive stuff, you’d get dozens releases of same movie, with almost no seeders (it already happens today, but on a very small scale)
Who wants to spend hours reading comments on forums, just to see if it’s the right release to take, honestly?
With scene standards, you automatically know it’s good =)
I couldn’t care less if all these sceners want to call themselves god or geniuses in their nfo, all i know is that they gave me a fantastic quality dvdscreener of 300 (just an example lol), and i thank them for that.
On a side note, one thing that makes me sick is all these private torrent trackers that exist thnaks to users donations.
When you see that some sites manage to get like 1200€ per month, it’s just sad.
Give this money to charity or to real useful projects, not warez sites and find and a better way to access those files, for God’s sake!!
“Scene releases are not made for the general public.They are made for the competing members in the different groups.”
But they are. If this would be the case, the scene wouldnt be what it is today.
“The fact that torrent uploaders are members on paytoleech sites and pay huge ammounts for their 0 day access does not mean that the Groups endorse them.”
Groups doesnt endorse them, but there have been several cases where the same groups do the same profiting as you said about paytoleech sites.
“The scene has always been internal , until torrents arrived.”
It has not been internal. THG in early 90s had boards, which were profiting. Everyone could pay they access on these boards. Razor were selling cds and shipping them into your address. There are several other cases like these.
Your statements about nostalgic holy scene in the “early” days just doesnt stand daylight.
Robert, its different thing to say something, than actually doing it.
well, in what i know the scene is NOT for public, is just internal, they (back n the day) shared rlses only betwen them, the scene groups, the REAL scene groups… and now they are trying to that once again, for the ol’ times sake…
but then what are we going to do… where do we get movies, music, games, for freee… I think it’s all about the respect, the scene doesn’t get the deserved respect, so… propz to the all scene groups and respect!!!
dad Burn, I see that you are here, so what needs to be asked is..What does it say about YOU? You get on your hypocritical high horse and decry almost everyone on the board that does not agree with you on the sceener and then admit that you “visit” other boards like this. Now does anyone with two brain cells to rub and make a spark honestly think that you have not “ehem…borrowed” a file or two? Considering the odds are that you have, your whining post is nothing more then being two faced as you are complaining about one issue while obviously doing the same thing yourself.
It is obvious that the sceeners and the hackErs do this for fame and nothing more, else why is it so important for them to be first to provide a screener or a 0-sec game/program? Or better yet, why allow it to be placed anywhere other then a private board? I mean y God man, there are newsgroups and BBoards and top sites and a host of others that carry these things so decrying that this is supposedly “secure” is the ultimate oxymoron.
get over yourself and get off your high horse/soapbox as you do the exact same thing that the rest of us here do, only we admit it while you try and fluff it off or deny it.
finally, for your snide remark about paying $30, tell you what einstein, you find me London after Midnight in ANY form and I will gladly pay you $300 for that movie. Until then I will keep looking and if I ever see it in a torrent format or any other format, I am going to snatch it no matter if you approve or not!
re: Robert
“The scene has always been internal , until torrents arrived.”
Thats a load of CROCK. Prior to torrents, scene releases were prevalent on public BBS, then via http://warez, IRC, FTP announcers and xdcc bots, mule to torrent.
Torrents are just a very reliable way of transferring packets and connecting shares. What makes Torrents such a great success is there is no longer the requirement for a host/central sharer and the resources to get the same effect can be met much easier with the assistance of the connecting nodes (as you understand).
My final say on the matter, is that its a childish action taken by the person and damaging to the scene’s underground respectable status that is may have. With that sort of attitude why don’t they join the police force [hold] perhaps not if they get a jail sentance for: Breaking federal law by breaching privacy & security, stalking, cracking, and unlawfully releasing the information to the public. That is a hefty crime that would weigh heavy on their shoulders if prosecuted against and the many parties now affected by it.
Idiots, way more people use P2P the Usenet anyway, but still, there’s absolutely no way they could actually take down P2P, it’s SO much bigger than ‘the scene’. The only way they could take P2P down is by stopping their releases.
@ finish_him..
Up to a point I can’t agrue with you.. but there is a huge difference between “teh scene” who issue copyrighted material and the groups who do stuff like fansubs.. they aren’t really the same thing.. if the top pirate scene groups disappeared then most of the stuff would still be available, probably after the fact..but fansub groups etc.. wouldn’t be affected, different market and different (if any) risks, it would also have the knock on effects for sales (which, honestly, I couldn’t care less about) and ,almost certainly, “the greedy little biitch” syndrome that has plagued users of the internet since this stuff began to be available.. In general I think it would help net society as a whole tremendously if we could begin to foster a community that was far less greedy, demanding and lame as it is.
As for standards.. if it was all we had access to then soon P2P would have their own standards and releasers of quality would be recognised…( especially with all the n00bs shouting “this sux0rs!!one11one!1!”
Personally I’d like to see cut backs in the amount of brand new stuff hitting the net, let the real creator’s (and by this I mean don’t mean the companies who market and publish) gather in a bit of money for their efforts before we start to pounce all over it, and give us all a chance to share our back catalogues with each other, it would definately cut down on the screaming, childish, greedy, self-centered behavour of the idiots who have grown up online and have come to believe that free new stuff is their god given right.
As for “teh scene” making any money at all.. in my mind that IS criminal.. they steal, repackage and SELL, THAT SUCKS!!.. if the creator’s don’t make anything, why the fux should those sh1theads?
If we aren’t willing to pay those who deserve it, then those who don’t, shouldn’t be cashing in either.
1 – THE REAL SCENE DOES NOT EVER USE ANYTHING FROM P2P, ONLY NEW FAKE GROUPS AND IMITATORS DO
2 – THEY ARE ALREADY PWNING P2P WITH MASS VIRUS DISTRIBUTION
3 – YOU WILL SOON BE DDOSED LOL
There’s just no honour amongst thieves any more.
I’d propose a 2 year copyright grace…
Anything being released having a 2 year shelf life and being banned from P2P with fines as penalties to the offending dl’ers or ul’ers, with jail time being reserved for those who it is proven have actually profitted from the products release.. this would include pirate scene and (unfortuantely) torrent site admins who profit from donations to their site… after 2 years then the copyright lapses and falls into public domain and we could do what the fux we wanted with it.. this would apply to individual formats (Dvd, bluray, etc, ad infinitum) and software build numbers although not patch versions..let’s face it, if you haven’t bought it within two years.. you’re not going to and people won’t simply wait two years to get it for free.
This would have the advantage of spurring progress on new products as the race to profit within the 2 year window would be on.. and would also do a lot to bring consummrs back in to the fold, so to speak.. it pretty evident that big business is rapidly becoming the main demon in society and that they are pretty much vilified by all in sundry.
The only exemption to the two year rule would be TV shows.. they air them for free, so by the very fact of giving them away in the first place they would be giving up their rights to protection, HOWEVER.. DVD’s of said programmes WOULD fall under said protection period.
Big business have to realise that their time of making profit infinately from copyrights that don’t lapse is OVER and that unless they want to be left with their very way of life crumbling around their greedy little necks that a NEW FAIR business model has to arise. Given a fairer business model their profit would exponentially rise and stupid “scene and P2P wars” would be a thing of the past, because the scene would all be in jail for breaching JUSTIFIABLE copyrighting laws.
@ 250 LMFAO
“The scene has always been internal , until torrents arrived.”
Noobish thing to say… I’ve been using stuf from the scene even before there was a widespread of the internet, much less torrents.
“The scene has always been internal , until torrents arrived.”
Scene releases has been used by very few people until torrenting arrived , because the ease of torrenting made everyone get hold of them.
The proper groups who do it for the credentials,are not into being famous in the general public. They want respect from their peers for their work ,not money or general fame . I know this is hard for many people to grasp , but thats just how it is .
The sceners have been getting more aggressive in recent years ,because their releases can be downloaded by everybody , and not just nerds around the world on ftps and on irc…
That is why they are getting upset,cause the release was never meant for “everybody” . Most honourable sceners buy their favourite apps\movies\games because they also want to support the developers..
These days when “everyone” can get the releases,it also brings alot of attention to the original sceners,and that is something they dont want..
I guess this site aswell is promoting scene releases to everyone , and therefore prolly in the line of fire for serious attacks in the future.
An easy way to solve the problem would be that torrentsites stopped uploading real group releases and only release their own crappy p2p releases , but hey .. torrent admins who have their own forum hoi polloi ,actually think they are contributing to the scene, when they are killing it . What will happen is that the groups will mark more and more releases internal ,and only release them on a few servers .. the torrent admins will loose their donations ,but they will still think it wasnt their fault …
Strange and greedy world ,we live in .
Me for one, cant wait for they day groups like reloaded,Air , rare and the rest go completely internal.
@248 Wibble,
You say you’d like to see the creators given time to profit from their works before “we” pounce all over it. There’s nothing stopping you from BUYING a copy regardless of whether there’s a free copy on the net.
@251 Wibble,
What you’ve described about copyrights being for a limited time is EXACTLY how copyrights were originally intended to work. To give the author a limited amount of time to profit from their work before it passes into the public domain and they lose control of it. I’m not sure I’d make it as low as two years, but it should definitely be a lot less than the current terms which are effectively twice the life of the author. Alternatively, I’d implement a system where a corporation would have to pay a yearly fee for each work they wanted to retain the copyright to. This fee would be high enough that eventually, they would no longer be able to afford to retain the copyrights on everything in their library and they would have to choose which are the most valuable to them. The fee for individuals to retain copyrights would be much lower.
Of course none of this is ever likely to happen since the media cartels have the various governments in their pocket.
I forgot to mention; I’ve never been part of “the scene”, but back in the mid 1980s, I was on several local pirate BBSs. I cracked a few games for the C64 and used a freezer cartridge to memory-dump others, and I uploaded every one of them to all the BBSs I was on. I didn’t do it to be famous (I was fairly well known locally though), but to share what I had. Sure, it was a thrill to have people know my online name, but I liked being able to give people new stuff. In some cases, I would rent games that previously only had screwed up copies (often due to PAL releases not working right on NTSC systems) and upload a good copy for people to enjoy. If possible, I’d put trainers on them, add a simple message at the start and spread it as far as I could. If somebody had a problem with anything I uploaded, I’d try to fix it for them and I was always open to offline trading. I met some good people that way, at least a couple I still stay in touch with.
I was never all that talented at cracking, but I think I was about the only person in this area that did any at all, at least publically. Most everyone else just uploaded whatever games they got by trading with others. I didn’t look down on anyone else or feel I should withhold the games I’d cracked. I wanted others to enjoy them.
Of course in those days, there wasn’t a huge push to bust small-time pirates like there is now, so uploading to a BBS was pretty safe.
@ Rekul..
“You say you’d like to see the creators given time to profit from their works before “we” pounce all over it. There’s nothing stopping you from BUYING a copy regardless of whether there’s a free copy on the net.”
Yep, quite right, and I wouldn’t wish for products to be banned from the market place after their 2 year protection, but they, in the end, will be copied anyways, so a manditory protective measure is neccessary, if people want to buy them after that period, fine, not a problem.
As for the rest of your post, I can’t disagree.. but preferably I’d like to see companies UNABLE to BUY copyrights, and for all ip to stay with the originator, with it being LICENCED from them and them recieving the vast bulk of the revenue.
“Most honourable sceners buy their favourite apps\movies\games because they also want to support the developers..”
What a load of bull…
The problem is THERE ARE A LOT OF PRIVATE TRACKERS, the scene can’t stop them all. Other problem is a lot of people have access to topsites – thank God!
That is why apps like Preee v3.00 is being worked on actively these days within the scene itself . With that app you avoid the need for topsites and couriers . Everything can be done easily by the hackers themselves within the app ,and no need for any other people outside the community to have access . The “scene” will never stop filesharing via bitorrent,but the “scene releases” available on bittorrent might,and probably will become smaller in the future.
I don´t know anything
time will tell 
Real sceners could care less about P2P, only tryhard sceners who can’t grasp the concept of the scene would even bother with going after any P2P sites… ironically they sound more suited as a P2P group than a scene group…
fat nigs, were you BORN an idiot or do you just try real hard? How the bloody he** do you think the “sceeners” get their releases to each other EXCEPT by a P2P ot FTP or Bboard site? I mean jeeze, use your head for something other then a place to place your hat and think about it. If they didnt use some form of P2P (file transfer) then there WOULDN’T BE ANY RELEASE GROUPS AS THEY WOULD HAVE NO WAY TO GET IT TO OTHER MEMBERS!!!
I used to argue that the net would make people smarter, in fat nigs case I have been proven wrong as it clearly makes some people dumber then sh*t
dan, ftp is not peer to peer, it’s client to server. p2p means connecting to another node in the network, rather than a central server.
While this isn’t right, they do have a point that the P2P scene is very unsecure, I was getting tons of nice little letters from my ISP for copyright infringement violations. Torrents use to be relatively secure, and “safe”. Now, once you grab a torrent, you have no idea if you will get another one of those letters, and better hope your not on comcast or else you just get shut off. Torrents are also easier to make, so you are getting crap releases. What I don’t understand is why they target private trackers, unless they used the same tactics as the MPAA’s sex slaves and test a tracker to see if they can easily slip in.
Big thing, is SSL everything you do with torrents, or don’t use them, and the sites need to promote that..
When compared to Usenet, Torrents suck, however, the last thing we need is a flood of usenet usage since most of the world looks at you weird when you say Usenet, you say torrent and even your 80 year old grandma knows what your up to…
In the end though, we did take the scenes world from them, before 13 year olds could use a torrent, and it was middle ground for the mostly tech savvy users, it was cool. However, as word spread, we got idiots using BT (and a LOT of them) and the MPAA had a little media fest. So, now this “cool underground scene” that was only seen by few, usually oldschool IRC & Usenet users is now a hot topic in the media.
So, being exposed to the world, obviously screeners are being handled more securely, and etc. We use to have awesome TC’s or Screeners a week before the movie came out, then about 6 months ago, that completely changed.
So if you are going to torrent, USE SSL.
IRC is all well and good (I used to use it a lot) but speed/time was an issue. People are saying that “IRC is dead”, IRC will never die, it’s still very active, and there are hundreds of file servers out there connected to IRC, just takes awhile to find them.
People in glass houses shouldn’t throw bricks. If they don’t want things released in public they need to get their own house in order. The public releases come from SOMEWHERE and instead of crying after the horse has bolted if they really want this to stop they need to lock their own gate first. If they can’t even do that then boo fecking hoo. It’s just so much QQ.
Fact is most of them are insecure guys probably without much of a life who want the attention and “fame” even though the irony is lost that 99.99999% of people who see or use their work don’t know and don’t care who the person is. Come on, who really gives a f*ck about some nickname on a screen? Nobody.
“well, in what i know the scene is NOT for public, is just internal, they (back n the day) shared rlses only betwen them, the scene groups, the REAL scene groups…”
This never happened. People always got their hands on “scene” stuff and it was never a closed club. The hardship of getting stuf was due to security measures, not exactly because they didn’t want people to get their stuff. Many of those who think that in the old days the “scene” was closed fall into these categories:
a) Are too young and have imagined an utopian past
b) Are reaccionary nostalgic of the past people with delusions of greatness who aren’t being able to cope with the moving of the times (AKA “aging is a b*tch for some people”).
NFOs used to salute people (all people, not scene friends) who got the release, in whatever way that happened. Now many groups act like they are something special and above all others and that is not the original “scene” i got to know as a youngster.
[QUOTE]Samsun
These ’sceners’ are not too bright. How hypocritical can they get. They steal copyrighted material, make it available to be shared, then moan about people stealing. Hmmm[/QUOTE]
They DO NOT ‘make it available for everyone’ the release scene and fxp scene are heavily dependant on each other and those involved in it work there arses off for there access.
What do you do to contribute when you fire up your P2P program? Nothing, other than drawing the attention of the authorities to the releases which puts people who put so much work in at risk.
So in principle they have a point. P2P takes and takes and gives nothing back other than danger. I do not agree with what they have done however, nobody deserves that.
Step by step, heart to heart, left right left
We all fall down like toy soldiers
Bit by bit, torn apart, we never win
But the battle wages on for toy soldiers….
SCENE_DELETE.
fjjhfgj
January 9th, 2008 | 12:23
dan, ftp is not peer to peer, it’s client to server. p2p means connecting to another node in the network, rather than a central server.
———————-
Fjjhfjj puh-leaze, it is still a file transfer no matter if it is done by a server or a p2p or a Bboard or e-mail or ftp (you say pototo and I say potato) makes no diff. The way fatNig was implying is that there were no file transfers from sceeners, that somehow they just appeared on the computers by magic.
Re-read my answer to him and you will see that I was telling him that no matter what he thinks, there will always be some form of a file transfer as if there were not, the whole sceener groups would die off. Simple as that. but thanks for trying to clarify what I said even though it was obvious what I ment to most who read the statement.
Truth be told this wasn’t an attack to help the scene or to a show of strength by the scene. This was and is a personal attack by a couple of jerks. The scene is nothing anymore without p2p, and p2p is nothing without the scene. If scene guys want their releases private then simply DO NOT RELEASE THEM! Does it get any simpler? Taking ones personal information and putting it out for the public benefits who?Nobody that’s who. This was personal and it will get more personal. CeLLKiLL will get his from Brandon, Brandon will get hit back and so the childish behaviour will continue. I have never paid anything to any private torrent site to download movies,games, or music. I never will. P2P and scene releases are meant to be free. Nobody is suppose to profit in any way, but those private torrent sites do have server bills to pay, isp bills, electricity bills, and so on. For there efforts to keep a torrent site going and looking nice, they should not profit? Use net and top scsne sites all cost too. Why aren’t these being attacked. Usenet has to make profit. This is why it is easy to scene that this was nothing more then a childish personal attack.
Can’t We All Just Get Along???
in regards to this matter remember when prince put is new album up for free for all to get hold of that caused ruptions in the money makers world how could he do that they said and not let us make anything from it,all this boils down to money.when a movie is made all involved from the actors to the cleaner of the set gets a shed load of dosh.they make there money, surely when a film as had its day and remains on the shelf of some rental store gathering dust sites like this and many others revive them and start the interest in that movie again,so what are they moaning at hell they cant lose.but this battle thats going on turning scene against p2p and vice versa needs to stop and all need to look around to see who gains from it and it wont be the scene or the p2p it will be someone in the background who has started the ball rolling and is now waiting till the battlefield is gathering its casualties and when there is no threat to them that is when they step in and take whatever it is they want from this.its only like buying a newspaper when you have read it how many of you have give it to someone or left it on a bus or tube you dont write your name on it do you telling the person who picks it up he cannot read it.well thats my version anyway.
Lol this thread is funny.
ok how many of you actually know what you are talking about? So far i haven’t seen a single person.
I see a lot of people saying ‘ if you don’t want it shared then don’t release it’ well they do want it shared they just don’t want you to share it publicaly with people who have done nothing to earn what they have downloaded which puts them at risk.
There are vast communities that share all these releases and none of them use a p2p app.
At least 50% of scene releases never even end up on p2p and what does is there becuase of leakers who are usually people who have abused there access because the only way they can get what they want is by sharing it on leakers sites. They have no talent and usually have ‘deletion pending’ under there names.
As i said i don’t condone what they did, but i certainly won’t lost any sleep over it.
I agree with the sceners. The scene does need to be more secure.
Sam you are absoolutly correct, all these “P2P” applications just allow people to “Browse” an active catalog of stuff to download like an “Interactive-Free-Wallmart” or provide a “Ticket to a Free Download(AKA Torrent Cues)” if somthing Majoy hits the Net like lets say Windows Vista Ultimate x86 people RACE to see who’s got the best and fastest access to it and get rewarded for being the winner! this would not be for “the Public Pear2Pear” network untill someone places it on a p2p network server or it gets picked up in a P2P-Item-Scan and gets listed in a Search Request, EVERYthing thats BRAND NEW and worth riping and uploading is done by Major RLS groups to put their stamp onit and Properly put on the Net with Their NAME!, it comes Stright from the Offices or the Source who’s closest to the companie or who ever has the master copy/s,….. It seems impossible to stop the scene altho they have come close to breaking a few major rls groups up in the past 18months…..
Deligated Member of The Infmous “Scene” network!
Im ready to throw down. Lets join and fight them back. These little girls who are scared and hiding behind their computers can come out and try to report me to my face… Lets see what happens. Broken noses all around