http://www.sabayonlinux.org/

but you have to know how to use it.

everything that herdzr says is true

peace out

Windows = bringing clueless computer users online since 1985.

################################################################
#
# “I installed Linux once… it didn’t seem to know what my mouse was, # or how to connect to the internet.
#
# So I went back to Windows. Linux sucks ass, unless you’re some kind # of masochist.”
################################################################

### -> Poor thing…I think you might want to rephrase that though in a different way:

# “I installed Linux once… I didn’t seem to know what my mouse was, # or how to connect to the internet.
#
# So I went back to Windows.

That sounds like a commercial

You are essentially one click away from updating your entire system to the latest possible release. Every binary on your system is updated to the latest stuff. My main server was installed from 2 floppy disks I created 3 years ago. There absolutely no argument, what so ever, that Linux is superior to Windows on the server side.

Any OSS that you would ever want is there for you, one click away. One place, and one way, for all installs and uninstalls. I can select 10 programs I need and want, press a button and walk away, 90% of the time I can come back 10 min later and use the programs, no questions asked. Some times, as in Windows, you do have to answer some preinstall questions.

Amazing power right at your fingertips. For instance, how long does it take you to extract a movie you just downloaded (like the once on this site). I download a lot form usenent. So here is my process:
1. CD into the directory ware rar and par movie files are saved.
2. type usenet-extract
Wow, wasn’t that easy True, it took maybe what, like 5 min to write a scrip that does that, but think of the ease.

Finally, linux is so much cooler, come one, you have to admit it, it’s just cooler.

Now, hear some disclaimer.
1. There are linux viruses. More over, there are a lot of linux root takeover viruses. Trust me, I can upgrade myself to root in a second on Linux, given a user access, default server install, and net access. You do not even have to be some guru to do that, all you need is an idiot admin who runs apache, ftp, or SQL as root.
2. Linux does not support a lot consumer side HW. A lot of scanners and printers, mice, keyboards, wifi cards are not supported. Most are however. A Joe 6pack will reatrly find such HW, but it’s out there, and it’s a PITS.
3. Linux isn’t perfect, even for servers, Sun Solaris is better, way better, but it’s crap as far as HW support.

I highly suspect you are a Windows developer trying to defend their position and income. (I see lots of them hang around forums, slashdot, mailinglist, etc, etc, etc. Blindly defending Microsoft when the overall tone of the thread goes sour.)

(1) dbcch’s comment about malware…

The view that “I’m more popular, so I get attacked more easily” is TOTAL BULLSHIT.

You are re-echoing Microsoft PR talk. They delibrately make trivial comments in their defense. Of course, no software is perfect! But does that mean you use it as an excuse to continue your path of poor design decisions and compromises?

How do you explain Apache vs MS’s solution? The alternative solution owns about 2/3rds of the web server market and is attacked less? And for the majority of those installations, they are Linux-based.

FACT: Microsoft HAS to make security compromises to make life easier for the clueless desktop user.

Why do you think everything is executable?

Why do you think they put UAC in Windows Vista?

FACT: Microsoft will NEVER solve their security issues properly. That is, they will NEVER re-write solutions to completely get rid of their fundamental security problems.

Have a think about that the next time a Windows security update is released, that re-addresses the same application with the same type of bug. (You can’t deny this, because I actively get MS security bulletins via email since 2002).

FACT: Microsoft can only release “band-aids” as security solutions. This is simply because it will take them TOO LONG to re-write and solve everything. Its quicker and cheaper just to keep throwing out band-aids. Band-aids DO NOT solve the problem. They merely delay the inevitable! They provide a false sense of security.

ie:
* UAC does not solve the fundamental issue that everything in Windows executable.

* OneCare Live does not solve the issues of Windows’s ability to be highly resistant to malware. Nor does it educate the user with good computing practices. All it does is ask for MONEY!

* The security features in Vista, implemented to protect Internet Explorer do NOT protect IE itself. Sandboxing is not an active solution. Its a reactive solution, because MS doesn’t want to waste time re-writing the application.

FACT: Microsoft’s design decisions aren’t always logical. Unlike Linux or BSD, there is no weenie in upper management that specifically and continually asks for a feature, which eventually turns out to be a big flop from the end-user’s view or a security concern.

MS’s designs are overcomplicated. If you want security, you need simplicity and clean code. These offer a much easier maintenance policy.

IF you claim you’ve programmed in BSD, you know that OpenBSD follows this regime. Their source code is clean, easy to maintain, and see bugs. So much so, while MS is dragging its nuts around monthly with patches, the OpenBSD team can address security concerns within hours. (The quickest I’ve seen them do is 4 hours of being notified).

This alone utterly shits on MS’s update policy.

Have you not noticed they dropped this month’s security patches? Even though every single version that is supported has a security issue!

FACT: Microsoft only does “just enough” to get by. Its been their business for over 20yrs. Do just enough, make the users feel like their secure and happy, charge them money and move on…Until a cracker or researcher comes along to demonstrate there is a flaw in their design.

Linux and BSD are more secure for three reasons.

(a) The user becomes educated over time.

Have you ever seen a Linux or BSD malware spread like Windows malware have? Have you ever seen an application that teaches a user how to harden their Windows boxes? Teach them what to look for when it comes to fake email?

(b) Their design goals aren’t hampered by clueless management idiots. (Nor are they purely motivated by money)

(c) They aren’t hampered by “train schedule” security update policies. If there is a problem, there is always an urge to address the issues within days. NOT MONTHLY nonsense.

(2) dbcch’s comment about resources is total nonsense.

Linux has better memory management than Windows. You realise this when you run out of RAM, and you see Windows use swap MUCH SOONER than Linux will. (That’s when your hard disk thrashes like crazy. Sometimes, if you set both systems with 256MB swap, you see Windows will quickly notify the user to see if its OK to make it LARGER! You don’t even do that in Linux or BSD!)

A typical desktop user on Linux will see they hardly hit 512MB RAM.

I’ve tested this using Firefox with 50 windows and tabbed windows open, 20 of which are at Youtube, Google, and Apple Movie Trailers (Quicktime)…All videos running. Azureus with SafePeer, aMule (Linux version of emule), Moblock (Same idea as PeerGuardian), OpenOffice’s Writer and Calc, Cinelerra (video editing), Matlab (Linux version), VariCAD (engineering CAD solution), with that stupid AIGLX/Beryl desktop effects fully enabled, both MPlayer and VLC media players playing two different movies…All at the same time.

And what do they recommend for Vista nowadays? 1GB to 2GB to run smoothly?

Not only is it a waste of resources, it also contributes to the environment. People WILL throw out old PCs and get new ones…Landfill. Ever been to China? Some areas are now dumping grounds for old systems, used toners, etc. The people there don’t know what to do with it, so they strip off all the stuff they can recycle, but burn all the stuff they can’t. Guess what comes out of that? Toxic fumes into the atmosphere.

You know those stupid desktop effects that both OSs have?

Linux can run them ALL on an old Nvidia TNT, but its really slowly. To improve things, you need a GF2MX as bare minimum. I can run it on my ThinkPad using an old Mobility Radeon 7500.

So what’s on the Windows side? What do you need to run Aero? Hmmm? Oh that’s right, you need a DirectX 9 compatible solution to get the “Full Vista Experience”. (And that’s only on selected versions).

You want to know what Linux offers me?

(1) No more defrag HDD and registry clean ups.

(2) When I run update, I update my whole system. That’s because everything I need is handled by the package manager and the distro’s repositories. (Most people are led to believe you need to compile EVERYTHING. That’s WRONG. You don’t compile anything unless you really need to).

In Windows, it only updates Office, Windows, and related. NOT third party apps. You’re on your own.

(3) No more pointless anti-piracy measures. (I want you folks to think about that the next time you look for a crack or serial).

(4) The OS is mine. I own it. I can do whatever I want with it. (In Windows, you PAY for the right to use it. YOU DO NOT OWN IT…Its NOT yours!)

(5) Flexibility. Something Windows will NEVER have.

If you want server, you need to get Win2k3 Server. If you want media center, you need MCE. If you want embedded, you need WinCE. In Linux, you add and remove bits that you need and don’t need. If I don’t like it, I re-compile and tweak whatever I want. I don’t sign some NDA with Microsoft or do some deal with them, to access the source code.

(6) NO monetary or income discrimination.

If you want to use Windows virtualization scenario, you need to pay for a more expensive version of Vista. If you don’t, you are violating EULA. Why is MS doing this? Because they can.

For the developing world, they have “Starter” edition of Windows. This is a SUPER NEUTURED version that is restricted to 3 apps allowed to run simultaneously, 800×600 resolution, etc.

For those multi-CPU socket mobo owners out there, you are restricted to certain Windows versions. Win2k/XP Pro only support up to 2 CPU sockets. What if you have 4? Too bad. Pay up!

(7) No need to install third-party security CRAP anymore. Which means less crap clogging up the system, which means LOWER system requirements. And thus, better for the environment as I consume less.

(8) I talk DIRECTLY to the package maintainer or developer.
When there is a problem, I don’t need to contact tech-support, waste days to weeks trying to escalate my issue until someone decent picks it up. I don’t have to wait MONTHS to get the issue resolved. I work WITH the developer in solving the problem.

(9) Nothing to hide.
The beauty of open-source itself. There’s nothing to hide, and honesty is promoted as a result of being open. Any FUD is always crushed with honesty.

Unlike like Microsoft, lots of bones in its closet. They even tried to get the Iowa case evidence removed from the web (as part of the settlement!). Too bad MS, us opensource people have archived EVERYTHING before it became inaccessible to the public.

Did you folks hear that even if you cancel the process with WGA, the solution STILL dials home to MS servers? It doesn’t warn you that it does. It does it without telling you. Wow!

Can you really trust Windows, if it doesn’t tell you what its EXACTLY doing? Can you guarantee 110% that MS hasn’t put in a hidden backdoor as an agreement with the Govt? You can’t because the public doesn’t have access the to source code. So no one can conduct a full and comphrensive audit on the code!

And for those who says you can’t play games on Linux…Ever heard of Wine? Its an application compatibility layer for running Windows apps on Linux, OSX, BSD, etc.

Here’s a few games that have worked for me under Linux:

* Jedi Knight: Jedi OutCast
* Jedi Knight
* Half Life 1 and 2
* CounterStrike: Source
* ALL Command & Conquer RTS games. Including the demo of “C&C3: Tiberium Wars”
* Battlefield 2142
* Call of Duty
* Call of Duty 2 (Multiplayer works, single does not.)
* Delta Force: Black Hawk Down (works, but graphical issues)
* Doom 3 (There’s also native Linux version)
* Quake IV (There’s also native Linux version)
* Unreal, Unreal II, Unreal Tournament, Unreal Tournament 2003, and Unreal Tournament 2004.
* Warhammer 40,000: Chaos Gate, and Dawn of War (including expanision discs)
* Warhammer: Mark of Chaos
* Warcraft II, III, and World of Warcraft.
* Star Wars: Galactic Battlegrounds
* Need for Speed 4 High Stakes (The only NFS that actually worked well for me).

Wine, although not perfect, its getting better. Games like FEAR, Star Wars: Republic Commando, Ghost Recon, Act of War: Direct Action, Battlefield 1942, etc are starting to work, but with bugs. Over time, the bugs will be resolved.

It will get to the point of asking yourself: “What’s the point of having Windows if I can run my games in Linux?”

Then it boils down to business and professional apps. (Photoshop CS2 works for me).

If Linux isn’t good enough, how do you explain its users who include Google, Pixar Animation Studios, Dreamworks, NASA, etc…Hell, even Microsoft uses it in their Linux Lab. (They want to keep an eye on Linux, because its fundamental model is a direct contradiction to their business model).

Microsoft Sucks!!!!

but dbcch is cool also. )

I actually find linux to be less responsive on application launch than Windows, likely due to the many optimizations to improve application load time in Windows that are not found on linux. But, linux is nice and has its merits.

Ah, why do I bother. Fanboys just annoy me so much with their ignorant evangelism.

If you like linux, great. I do too, but I also appreciate Windows. Microsoft has a lot more responsibility and customers than any other software company and aren’t doing so bad considering that. It’s easy to be a critic.

Now, quit trying to convert EVERYONE to your preferences. Usually it backfires on you anyway since people get defensive. I for one am tired of hearing from the linux fanboys who really have no clue about anything and just believe themselves to be cooler than Windows users.

As a developer for both operating systems, I do know the facts, and I do know that neither opeating system is inherently superior to the other.

The idiots who claim that there are no virii/spyware for linux, BSD, OS X, or other non-Windows systems are misleading everyone. The only reason that there aren’t more viruses is because the market share is so low for those operating systems that nobody creates a virus. All mentioned operating systems are as susceptible as Windows to viruses and spyware – get a clue. If the roles were reversed, and Windows had very low market share, *IT* would be nearly virus free and the argument would be reversed.